2012 R6 - First Track Day - Looking For Advice/Tips - Page 2 - Yamaha R6 Forum: YZF-R6 Forums
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post #11 of 26 (permalink) Old 04-15-2019, 11:38 AM Thread Starter
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Re: 2012 R6 - First Track Day - Looking For Advice/Tips

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Originally Posted by Straight Success View Post
I would pull the valve cover, drain the oil, and inspect things that way first. The oil and the visual under the valve cover will give you an idea. I would also removed all of the fuel injectors and inspect them.
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Originally Posted by The Evil Twin View Post
Yeah, it is a live n learn thing man. I either store a tank filled to the brim or for serious long term storage I will empty it and dump a bottle of 2 cycle oil in it and coat the entire inside with it.


Curious why pull the valve cover or drain oil? Any contamination will be on the fuel side. The injectors won't show anything to the naked eye and I doubt anything of note made it past the filter sock. Anything that made it past that should pass the injector orifice. As long as the sock is not damaged. I have had worse tanks that did not hurt the injectors.
I appreciate all the advice guys!

Well, I found a local radiator shop with excellent reviews that said they can clean and seal my tank for around $80. For me, time is $$$, and this sounds like an excellent deal since the products to do it alone will cost almost that much. So, looks like I may get out of this pretty inexpensively.

Of course, I plan on this being a temporary solution, and getting another tank as a replacement. Still trying to find an undamaged one though. Will keep trolling the FS section and eBay. lol
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post #12 of 26 (permalink) Old 04-15-2019, 05:20 PM
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Re: 2012 R6 - First Track Day - Looking For Advice/Tips

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Originally Posted by The Evil Twin View Post
Yeah, it is a live n learn thing man. I either store a tank filled to the brim or for serious long term storage I will empty it and dump a bottle of 2 cycle oil in it and coat the entire inside with it.


Curious why pull the valve cover or drain oil? Any contamination will be on the fuel side. The injectors won't show anything to the naked eye and I doubt anything of note made it past the filter sock. Anything that made it past that should pass the injector orifice. As long as the sock is not damaged. I have had worse tanks that did not hurt the injectors.
To inspect. Oxidation can crumble into very fine particles and pass through the injectors possibly causing more damage by scoring metal components. There are pins in the injectors that can get damaged/bent, and if there's particulates in the oil from passing through the injectors, it's a good chance some minor scoring on cyllinder walls may be present. I can go deeper for an in-depth explantion, but it's no need. It's basically a gateway to an thorough inspection.

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Originally Posted by KBkilla View Post
I appreciate all the advice guys!

Well, I found a local radiator shop with excellent reviews that said they can clean and seal my tank for around $80. For me, time is $$$, and this sounds like an excellent deal since the products to do it alone will cost almost that much. So, looks like I may get out of this pretty inexpensively.

Of course, I plan on this being a temporary solution, and getting another tank as a replacement. Still trying to find an undamaged one though. Will keep trolling the FS section and eBay. lol
I would say just buy a new/pre-owned tank and filter with no oxidation as you stated. Patience is still a virtue. It may run a little more, but I'm sure it'll be worth it.

All the best with getting her back to good health.

Chillin'... while the Lord watches over me!

I love my R6, but...there's no buts...
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post #13 of 26 (permalink) Old 04-16-2019, 04:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Straight Success View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Evil Twin View Post
Yeah, it is a live n learn thing man. I either store a tank filled to the brim or for serious long term storage I will empty it and dump a bottle of 2 cycle oil in it and coat the entire inside with it.


Curious why pull the valve cover or drain oil? Any contamination will be on the fuel side. The injectors won't show anything to the naked eye and I doubt anything of note made it past the filter sock. Anything that made it past that should pass the injector orifice. As long as the sock is not damaged. I have had worse tanks that did not hurt the injectors.
To inspect. Oxidation can crumble into very fine particles and pass through the injectors possibly causing more damage by scoring metal components. There are pins in the injectors that can get damaged/bent, and if there's particulates in the oil from passing through the injectors, it's a good chance some minor scoring on cyllinder walls may be present. I can go deeper for an in-depth explantion, but it's no need. It's basically a gateway to an thorough inspection.
.
Exceptionally highly unlikely. That is a bit over the top. tIt isnt like you would see anything in the oil (if a solid went past the rings the motor was shot to begin with) and you would have to pull the head to look at a cylinder... Not a valve cover. Unless you used a bore scope through the spark plug hole. But then why remove anything but the plug?
Anything that passed through the sock or injector is going to get pulled out with the exhaust.

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post #14 of 26 (permalink) Old 04-16-2019, 06:38 AM
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Re: 2012 R6 - First Track Day - Looking For Advice/Tips

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Evil Twin View Post
Exceptionally highly unlikely. That is a bit over the top. tIt isnt like you would see anything in the oil (if a solid went past the rings the motor was shot to begin with) and you would have to pull the head to look at a cylinder... Not a valve cover. Unless you used a bore scope through the spark plug hole. But then why remove anything but the plug?
Anything that passed through the sock or injector is going to get pulled out with the exhaust.
In theory, you are 100% correct, and it's a good chance there's no damage. As far as a bore scope, you're spot on. The thing is, these motors are spinning 12K-15+K times a minute while at the track - you obviously know by looking at your resume. In addition, there's always residual fluid left behind in the cylinder during each opening and closing cylce of the valves. How do you think people cylinder walls get scored up and their oil gets dirty after running with no air filter? Same concept. Paticulate matter can be very small, and at times, finds ways to pass the rings; maybe the ring end gaps. Sometimes, you can see particulates floating in the oil. I know I did when I drained mine after a mechanical failure.


EDIT: Also, this is for those looking into long time storage. If you read this, it works well. Just add more d-packs.


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Chillin'... while the Lord watches over me!

I love my R6, but...there's no buts...
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post #15 of 26 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 09:11 AM
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Yeah, I mean running without an air filter is one thing. Crystallization off of a FI is a bit different. If that chunk goes past the rings its a different game. Mechanical failure is a totally different game. There is blow by for sure, I just dont see something 150 microns in size getting past the rings. It'll either be pushed out or rattle around until the cylinder fails. Exhaust scavenging is going to pull debris out in short order as long as debris doesnt keep getting thrown in (like having no air filter) it'll be fine.

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post #16 of 26 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 03:50 PM
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Re: 2012 R6 - First Track Day - Looking For Advice/Tips

You do understand that the injectors are pulsing anywhere from ~ 2.5 - 3.5 ms at idle? At WOT, it's a whole different ball game with the rate and speed at which they spray in fuel - simple multiplication depending on the signal sent to the injectors. You do know that the fuel filter will not catch 100% of the oxidized iron (steel) from the rusted tank? Guess where that oxidized iron (steel) saturated fuel is going? Through the injectors, past the injector pins, and into the combustion chamber. He did what, 3 or 4 sessions with that situation? That's a lot of time and a lot of particulate that could potentially get somewhere it doesn't belong. My $0.02.

In short, I just want the OP to ensure he has no more problems down the road. Peace of mind!

Chillin'... while the Lord watches over me!

I love my R6, but...there's no buts...
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Last edited by Straight Success; 04-17-2019 at 03:55 PM.
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post #17 of 26 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 06:08 PM
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Re: 2012 R6 - First Track Day - Looking For Advice/Tips

jesus... ALL fuel pumps have a sock or prefilter. Tossing a tank because of some surface rust that $50 worth of chemical will fix permanently??? Glad you dont work on bikes professionally...lol
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post #18 of 26 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 06:52 PM
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Re: 2012 R6 - First Track Day - Looking For Advice/Tips

I'm not sure who your comment was directed to, but I'll state this. Yes, Yamaha makes
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. For something sitting for that long, and that amount of rust, there are many other factors to consider. I personally have never used that product or read the specs. Rust, over time, causes degredation - degredation to the sheet metal, to the welds/seals/seams, to the hardware... That amount of rust, although probably not a serious structural issue, could potentially be a safety factor.

I'll digresss on that note, but I tend to tread toward long term safety first over saving a few dollars. A pre-owned rust free tank can be had for an inexpensive amount of change.

Chillin'... while the Lord watches over me!

I love my R6, but...there's no buts...
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post #19 of 26 (permalink) Old 04-18-2019, 02:05 PM
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Re: 2012 R6 - First Track Day - Looking For Advice/Tips

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Originally Posted by Straight Success View Post
I'm not sure who your comment was directed to, but I'll state this. Yes, Yamaha makes
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. For something sitting for that long, and that amount of rust, there are many other factors to consider. I personally have never used that product or read the specs. Rust, over time, causes degredation - degredation to the sheet metal, to the welds/seals/seams, to the hardware... That amount of rust, although probably not a serious structural issue, could potentially be a safety factor.

I'll digresss on that note, but I tend to tread toward long term safety first over saving a few dollars. A pre-owned rust free tank can be had for an inexpensive amount of change.

Im going to guess you havent wrenched or restored a vintage motorcycle?? Very few can be descaled dry. Most need acid level cleaning. That tank could easily have been cleaned dry & then sealed.
Long term schlong term. Hence when the "winterization" questions come up my first suggestion is to "drain the tank". Dipshits do the exact opposite then add some bullshit chemical...lol A quality siphon hose is all of $10 and its really easy to drain a tank that way.
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post #20 of 26 (permalink) Old 04-18-2019, 08:30 PM
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Re: 2012 R6 - First Track Day - Looking For Advice/Tips

You, as well as I, don't know everything. Once in a while you need to be reminded of that. We all learn on a continuous basis.

Experience is the best teacher, and even those with experience can be wrong and learn something new. I have the tools and knowledge to solve complex problems of this nature on a deeper level than some. That's why I spent the last 12 years learning how to be a good problem solver. Some problems, I haven't run into yet, and I haven't run into a problem I couldn't solve yet. Some solutions just takes more time - I'm always working.

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I love my R6, but...there's no buts...
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