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For me it's hard to understand what are the befefits of using so big rear tire in a 600cc. Bigger tire contact area on the corner? Is that it? If so, I think this isn't strong enough advantage. We need to tune up our geometry, the engine has a power loss because of the bigger tire, we also put on some weight, bigger sizes are usually more expensive ... I don't get it.
 

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Team STG Racing
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just wonder how the bigger than even 190 rear will affect the bike flicking back/forth in the esses at Road Atlanta? keep us posted.
It didnt.

That is where i was when i used it, Road Atlanta. In the video in this thread, I am on the 200 rear.
http://www.r6-forum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=166574

I was still able to keep it in 3rd gear, pinned to the stop, going through the esses...with no issues.
I was still able to get through the chicane at the top of T2 with no issues. I didnt lose any ground to anybody through there all weekend.
As obvious in the video, I didnt lose any top speed either.

People just don't realize how light the Power Cups are. IIRC, the 190/55 Cup rear is 2.3lbs lighter than the 190 GPA DOT. The 200 Cup rear is still going to be lighter than a tire anybody else is on (unless they are on a 190 Cup rear).
 

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"The Dude abides .. "
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For me it's hard to understand what are the befefits of using so big rear tire in a 600cc. Bigger tire contact area on the corner? Is that it? If so, I think this isn't strong enough advantage. We need to tune up our geometry, the engine has a power loss because of the bigger tire, we also put on some weight, bigger sizes are usually more expensive ... I don't get it.
Sikor, when you are at a point when you are chasing a rider, and having to slowly feed the gas because your 180 is spinning mid corner not hooking up.. and then you get on a 190 rear and the bike has SOOO much more grip mid corner, you will understand why it works (at some tracks) :) . It can make such a difference, the front can push if you don't have a good front tire or the suspension working for you to keep the bike turning with the added rear grip.
It's not just about a faster individual lap time either. It often will not show a significantly faster lap.. what it WILL do is not fall off grip as quickly as a 180. So you end up with a lower ELAPSED time of a race. For me, i find i don't have the racer in front of me pulling a bike length exiting a corner when they are on the Dunlop or Pirelli 190 and i have to charge the next corner extra hard to make it up. With a 190 Power CUp, i find im able to get on the gas the same, not loose the bike length or more exiting the corner, and thus have a better shot of lining up a pass later (or, not having the rider behind me pulling up along side before we even exit the corner).

There ARE advantages to a 190 (and perhaps a 200 but not convinced of that just yet as Chris is). There ARE times when a 180 works better too, but trust me, if the 190 did not provide a positive outcome all the mfgs. would not be making 190/55 tires.
 

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Team STG Racing
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For me it's hard to understand what are the befefits of using so big rear tire in a 600cc. Bigger tire contact area on the corner? Is that it? If so, I think this isn't strong enough advantage. We need to tune up our geometry, the engine has a power loss because of the bigger tire, we also put on some weight, bigger sizes are usually more expensive ... I don't get it.
1/2 bike length.

That is the difference.

1/2 of a bike length is the difference between you being able to make that block pass...and you having to pull back because it is still his line.

Losing that 1/2 of a bike length because the guy you are chasing was able to get on the gas sooner and/or harder exiting the previous corner is where the lack of additional drive grip comes into play.
 

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Team STG Racing
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Greg, im still not 100% sold on the 200. Like i said, i tried it because they didnt have any more 190's on hand. The 190 i had on the bike had a lot of laps on it. So it could have been that what i was feeling could be contributed more to the fact that the tire was new.

The only way to be sure would be to put a new 190 on...then put a new 200 on.

I can say without a doubt (due to the XT GPS lap timer) that i did not lose any time at all through the esses and i did not lose any top speed on the back stretch.

The jury is still out on the benefits of the 200, but i am sure there are no disadvantages. If there were, i would have seen them at Road Atlanta easier than anywhere else.

BTW - I know Greg knows this, but for everyone else it should be noted that i am riding a built R6 with a very healthy motor and using race fuel. It is highly possible that somebody going to such a tire on a stock 600 could very well see some disadvantages.
 

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Why are you running a 200 bro? So much unnecessary weight in the rear. I guarantee you aren't needing a 200 dude.



More grip at a FULL lean.



You shouldn't be racing on them really. You'll never get the drive that the other racers have. A DOT has a TON more grip and I'm not sure about your class, but we have to run DOT's and it would suck to get contested and DQ'd for running a non DOT tire!



They are a VERY tall tire. ESPECIALLY with the 190 rear. Run the 180, there's no need for the 190. It gets so tall on the 5.5 rim. I ran thru countless sets of these tires all year. The 190 is a lot of extra weight, the bike is way slower. Bikes you pass all day will now gradually inch past you on a half mile straight. It's like dropping a tooth on the rear sprocket when you run the 190.

The 190 is 2mm taller than the 180 on the R10's. If you run them, with the 180, drop your front ride height 2mm. Or if you run the 190, you can remove the shim.

HOT off the track target pressure is 34 front and 33 psi rear. When the tire gets to the wear bar it starts slipping and the carcass is super pliable. Drop to 31 PSI off the track at that point to maintain grip and heat on that shagged side of the tire.

These tires let you know when the pressure is off. The front pinches, feel horrible, and the rear has enormous balls of rubber when you run the PSI too cold.

With the 190 I was hardly able to ever reach the edge of the tire cause it bows up quite a bit.

Not sure what you're running now, but the R10's were 5mm taller than the pirelli diablo's front and rear. The 190 rear was 7mm taller.
Because the rolling diameter is bigger therefore it's like having another tooth at the main gear this is why when MotoGP riders take turns they run way wide because the side of the tire is smaller so the torque is higher like having more teeth to the rear sprocket.

1000s use 200 I think but 180s can't lean as far I think. CT2 has 51.2 degree lean angle. Superbikes can do 63 degrees (someone showed a pic) so I assume 63/64 lean angle requires 200. I'm more about the acceleration than the lean angling so your information was great for me. Of course the power of the 1000s can move the heavier tire easier than 600s.
 

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ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒ&
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AMA runs 190 because DUNLOP's 190 is like a 180 (race tires). Notice they don't make 180 nTecs? That's cause they make 190s and 200s. I've run 180 and 190 and prefer the 180

Dunlop Racing » D211GP

http://www.pirelli.com/tyre/ww/en/motorcycle/sheet/diablo_supercorsa_sc.html


Sent from my Motorcycle iPad app
uuuummm Surprise
180/60×17 KR451 Rear USA N-Tec Slick
Fitment specs Rear: 180/55×17 KR451 DUAL COMPOUND
Recommended Rim range (5.50), Best Rim (5.50)
Width (184mm), Diameter (656mm)
Available Compounds: SUPER SOFT 0129, SOFT 0097, MED+ 0585
Pressures: Hot on the warmers 22-25 psi, or cold 19-22 psi

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=28&v=xZ7j8KIk_l0
 

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I've read running a 190 makes the bike significantly slower on an R6 (those who have used both) than a 180 but if you have always ran a 180 you would not know it's "slower".
 

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Sikor, when you are at a point when you are chasing a rider, and having to slowly feed the gas because your 180 is spinning mid corner not hooking up.. and then you get on a 190 rear and the bike has SOOO much more grip mid corner, you will understand why it works (at some tracks) :) . It can make such a difference, the front can push if you don't have a good front tire or the suspension working for you to keep the bike turning with the added rear grip.
It's not just about a faster individual lap time either. It often will not show a significantly faster lap.. what it WILL do is not fall off grip as quickly as a 180. So you end up with a lower ELAPSED time of a race. For me, i find i don't have the racer in front of me pulling a bike length exiting a corner when they are on the Dunlop or Pirelli 190 and i have to charge the next corner extra hard to make it up. With a 190 Power CUp, i find im able to get on the gas the same, not loose the bike length or more exiting the corner, and thus have a better shot of lining up a pass later (or, not having the rider behind me pulling up along side before we even exit the corner).

There ARE advantages to a 190 (and perhaps a 200 but not convinced of that just yet as Chris is). There ARE times when a 180 works better too, but trust me, if the 190 did not provide a positive outcome all the mfgs. would not be making 190/55 tires.
I think it has more "grip" because the power is less from it being heavier at the back though. I've read where a 190 will make the R6 slower and not pull as good as on a 180. Of course when the power is less you won't slip it out and at the limit you would lose the lack of subtle traction. So it's like losing HP/Torque mid-corner like traction control but the "placebo" of having More grip under full throttle.
 

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I've read running a 190 makes the bike significantly slower on an R6 (those who have used both) than a 180 but if you have always ran a 180 you would not know it's "slower".
I think it has more "grip" because the power is less from it being heavier at the back though. I've read where a 190 will make the R6 slower and not pull as good as on a 180. Of course when the power is less you won't slip it out and at the limit you would lose the lack of subtle traction. So it's like losing HP/Torque mid-corner like traction control but the "placebo" of having More grip under full throttle.
Nobody cares what you read. They care what these guys have done it is called experience. Faster lap times are faster lap times, the is nothing placebo about them. What you have is bullshit and when the clock stops so does the bullshit. Either go and do it and prove your silly theory or piss off.
 

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Nobody cares what you read. They care what these guys have done it is called experience. Faster lap times are faster lap times, the is nothing placebo about them. What you have is bullshit and when the clock stops so does the bullshit. Either go and do it and prove your silly theory or piss off.
w/e, if you don't want to believe what I've read so what

If I'm ever tracking an Superbike I will be on a 200 michelin for sure
 

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w/e, if you don't want to believe what I've read so what

If I'm ever tracking an Superbike I will be on a 200 michelin for sure
Believing is for people god lovers mate. The rest of us deal in facts.

The bold bit says everything about what you know.

Why would you run a 200 when YOU only use the middle 40mm?

You are a joke.
 
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