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Discussion Starter #1
I was wondering if anyone had any tips for smooth braking while blipping the throttle down the gears?

Yes, I did use the search function :YEA, but all I found was endless threads about blipping technique... I feel like my blipping itself is fine, I’m just struggling to keep my braking even when doing it. I picked up blipping very quickly, but I’m just getting nowhere with the braking.

I know a lot of it is just going to come down to more practise, but if anyone has any tips they found when learning themselves, I’m very interested. I’m currently using two fingers on the brakes... index and middle... mostly because others have said they had better results this way... I feel like I was maybe a little smoother on the braking when I was using all fingers on the lever, but I do like being able to keep my other fingers on the bar now that I’m used to it.
 

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Well I only use my index finger to brake that way I still have control of the throttle but I know some guys use there index and thumb to control the throttle while the other three fingers brake. It all comes down to how you are comfortable in doing it. If what you are currently doing isn't working I would try somehting different. It might feel weird but just do something different. It does come down to practice but some teachers would tell you to just concentrate on one thing each session until it becomes habit. Until you just don't have to think about it until it is just a reflex instead of a reaction.

I am no pro by any means but this is some of what I have learned out on the track taking advice from lots of people. One thing to remember is there is not just one right way to do things there are many and it just comes down to personal riding style. If you ever meet ayone who tells you there is only one right way or one right line listen to them politely and just remember that they are wrong. Do what works for you and get plenty of practice.
 

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Meh
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You can try adjusting your brake lever to be closer to the bar. That'll give you a little 'slack' in your fingers so that blipping the throttle isn't going to force you to pull harder on the brakes.
 

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Derp
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I was wondering if anyone had any tips for smooth braking while blipping the throttle down the gears?

Yes, I did use the search function :YEA, but all I found was endless threads about blipping technique... I feel like my blipping itself is fine, I’m just struggling to keep my braking even when doing it. I picked up blipping very quickly, but I’m just getting nowhere with the braking.

I know a lot of it is just going to come down to more practise, but if anyone has any tips they found when learning themselves, I’m very interested. I’m currently using two fingers on the brakes... index and middle... mostly because others have said they had better results this way... I feel like I was maybe a little smoother on the braking when I was using all fingers on the lever, but I do like being able to keep my other fingers on the bar now that I’m used to it.
You got an 08, don't worry bout blipping. :flex:

I actually blip out of habit, even though I really don't need to. I use two fingers on the brake and use my thumb and palm to blip. Hard to describe really.
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
but some teachers would tell you to just concentrate on one thing each session until it becomes habit.
Good point, I think I might start just getting the hand position right and stable without actually putting a lot of force on the brakes, since that is when it all gets very sloppy... I usually start shifting down early when approaching say a red light anyway, and often end up using the brakes barely at all, but at least if I drag the brakes a little every time it might start to feel more natural.

You can try adjusting your brake lever to be closer to the bar. That'll give you a little 'slack' in your fingers so that blipping the throttle isn't going to force you to pull harder on the brakes.
I have Pazzo shorties, so I'll give this a try. I've just left it on 4 since I bought the bike. yut ught! :toocool:

You got an 08, don't worry bout blipping. :flex:
But it sounds so cool! :D But seriously, on the odd occassion I haven't blipped lately, I've noticed how much rougher the shifts are, even with the slipper clutch. Back when I had my 250, I got the back end real gnarly a couple of times from downshifting without blipping,that sort of scared me into always blipping and I find it hard not to anymore.

I actually blip out of habit, even though I really don't need to. I use two fingers on the brake and use my thumb and palm to blip. Hard to describe really.
Yeah, sounds pretty close to how I'm doing it at the moment.
 

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Make noise.
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You got an 08, don't worry bout blipping. :flex:

I actually blip out of habit, even though I really don't need to. I use two fingers on the brake and use my thumb and palm to blip. Hard to describe really.
^^^^This.

/thread.
 

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track junkie
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I was wondering if anyone had any tips for smooth braking while blipping the throttle down the gears?

Yes, I did use the search function :YEA, but all I found was endless threads about blipping technique... I feel like my blipping itself is fine, I’m just struggling to keep my braking even when doing it. I picked up blipping very quickly, but I’m just getting nowhere with the braking.

I know a lot of it is just going to come down to more practise, but if anyone has any tips they found when learning themselves, I’m very interested. I’m currently using two fingers on the brakes... index and middle... mostly because others have said they had better results this way... I feel like I was maybe a little smoother on the braking when I was using all fingers on the lever, but I do like being able to keep my other fingers on the bar now that I’m used to it.
it's difficult to learn if you're trying to do it on the street. when on the track, it's a quick and violent action done while you have a FIRM grip on the brake lever. on the street it's sorta like trying to type with heavy leather gloves on...


s3aturnr
 

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www.1seven1.com
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Practice! :D










Actually, if you do the slipperclutch mod and are smooth with your clutch release you don't really need to "blip." I do, but only because I've done it for like 30 years and it's engrained in my riding technique. If I was starting out, I'd spend more time practicing smooth braking, throttle and clutch.

A really good drill Pridmore teaches is to keep a constant speed and go up and down in gears holding that speed. Stay at about 40, and go 1-2-3-4-5-6, 6-5-4-3-2-1 releasing the clutch each time. It's tough. I practice this a lot if I find myself getting choppy at the controls.
 

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Adrenaline Junkie
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I've actually been trying to get the hang of this lately for emergency stops and practice when coming up to a light at higher speed. What started working for me was adjusting my hand on the throttle to where the cable had no slack and the throttle would open as soon as I turned it, then put my fingers on the lever and only use my fingertips. This allows me more room to twist the throttle to blip, rather than having more of my fingers over the lever and having to slide them over with the throttle turn (which just made my braking choppy). I use my ring, pinky, and palm with thumb to twist the throttle. It's pretty hard to explain but it's been getting smoother and smoother for me this way. Still mess up sometimes but it's a lot less than the way I tried it before. I can make a vid for you to show you what I mean if you want.
 

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Track Only!
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it's difficult to learn if you're trying to do it on the street. when on the track, it's a quick and violent action done while you have a FIRM grip on the brake lever. on the street it's sorta like trying to type with heavy leather gloves on...


s3aturnr
ˆˆ this.



Sent from my Droid
 

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iRun
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You got an 08, don't worry bout blipping. :flex:

I actually blip out of habit, even though I really don't need to. I use two fingers on the brake and use my thumb and palm to blip. Hard to describe really.

The 06+ had a stock slipper, but it sucks. I still had the rear sliding all over on me during hard braking/downshifting at my first track day.... So you definitely can't just dump it.
 

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I crashed twice because of being too hot on the brakes and trying to blip, causing the brake lever to squeeze more than I had intended. When I would roll my palm to get the blip in, my index and middle finger were getting caughton the brake lever and in turn would apply more pressure than intended. This is a great topic. I'm still trying to figure out what works best for me. In situations where I don't necessarily need to be hard on the brakes, I will blip, but if I'm trying to get down one more gear before I tip in, I'm trying to just feather the clutch.

Here is an awesome response to the question, to blip or not to blip that Nick Campbell of the CRA came up with in his school of Rider Objectives Confidence and Control:

DOWNSHIFTING

To Blip, or not to Blip...

Some riders always do it, some never do it and some mix the two approaches.

Benefits of blipping: Quicker rev matching
Cons of blipping: Can interfere with brake action and in most cases MUST be done while straight up and down on the bike to preserve stability if brake action is affected. (<---this happens to many riders).

Benefits of clutching out/non-blipping: More accurate, Chassis and Braking stability while straight up or at LEAN. Better control/feel over the rear wheel (if let out too fast traction could be lost, but you can feel this and control it by being slower with your clutch hand)
Cons of clutching out/non-blipping: Generally takes longer to rev match, More timing sensitive (too soon requires you to fan the clutch much longer)

So, can you see an instance where you could benefit from one or the other? Or maybe a combo of both?
As you get faster you will be doing more control items (braking/clutching) sometimes later, but most definitely LONGER in the corners. Simple math will tell you that if you enter a corner faster than before, you will need to downshift later so not to overwhelm the engine or tire. You may actually be on the brakes SOONER though... What does this mean? You will be relying on your brakes to do more of the slowing, not your engine as you increase you approaching speed. Too early with the down shifts can kill your potential corner speed AND cause instability. Go to the brakes, take a breath- then start down shifting... this will set the stage for a better entry.

Here's a couple BIR Turn 3 approach examples (apply to any corner):

1. If I have all the time I need and not looking to make a position change I want the smoothest/most accurate entry I can get to maximize my drive out and keep the pace high. I generally do not blip at all. I simply go to the brakes and slowly release my 2-3 downshifts individually, being careful not to scrub too much speed by releasing too quickly. The last downshift just prior to tip in, still releasing the clutch while lightly trail braking.

2. If a passing situation arises, OR I'm looking to be defensive against a pass, I will be a touch later on the brakes and blip at least the first downshift ( quicker rev matching ) and then get back into accurate mode with the clutching out method, because I'm clearly going to be asking more of the brakes/front tire in this situation and do not want it to be overwhelmed. My line will be adjusted also, if passing or in defense of a pass.
This is NOT the fast way through the corner, but what it lacks in exit speed, it nets a potential position, or retaining your current spot. I see a lot of novice riders rushing the entry of many corners with no reason at all, late braking is for POSITION change only.

Be Adaptable.

Hopefully this helps sheds some light on something you may, or may not be starting to figure out on your own. The faster you want to get, the more delicate you need to be- even as violent as it can appear to others, your connection to the bike key.

In ROCC we go through many race strategies like this.

Helpful?
Nick
 

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Knee drags YOU!
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I haven't read this thread, but let me tell you my own experience.

There's no slipper clutch on my '05. That means you either blip or the back end is going to chatter and slide all over.


My first TD, I just let off the brakes to downshift separately. That works, but you are upsetting the bike, and it takes longer.

I practiced a little on the road on our '73 RD250, and although the bike is very different, the hand movements are the same.

For the next TD, I set my lever one notch closer to the clipon, and kept practicing. Definitely messed up a few times, and chattered/slid the rear around. Sometimes scary, but got to be a little fun by the end.

Right now, after my 4th TD, i've got the hang of it. I've paid specific attention a few times to what I am doing with my hands, and i'm braking mostly with my middle finger, using my pointer a little.

I'm blipping with the rest of my hand, and kind of rolling the grip on my thumb, if that makes any sense.

It also helps, if you keep the weight off your hands by gripping the tank with your legs. I still need practice with this, but my lower clipons make me very aware when I start to put weight on my hands.

You don't have to get the revs perfect, even a non-slipper clutch will take up some rev difference.

Just keep practicing, you'll get it :)

Oh, and it's more fun and sounds cooler then a slipper clutch ;)
I'm really starting to enjoy banging down the gears while hard on the brakes, all the while setting up for the corner.

=========

P.S. - Make sure you've adjusted your hand controls. Even with the stock stuff you can rotate the brake/clutch lever up and down.
 

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I haven't read this thread, but let me tell you my own experience.

There's no slipper clutch on my '05. That means you either blip or the back end is going to chatter and slide all over.


My first TD, I just let off the brakes to downshift separately. That works, but you are upsetting the bike, and it takes longer.

I practiced a little on the road on our '73 RD250, and although the bike is very different, the hand movements are the same.

For the next TD, I set my lever one notch closer to the clipon, and kept practicing. Definitely messed up a few times, and chattered/slid the rear around. Sometimes scary, but got to be a little fun by the end.

Right now, after my 4th TD, i've got the hang of it. I've paid specific attention a few times to what I am doing with my hands, and i'm braking mostly with my middle finger, using my pointer a little.

I'm blipping with the rest of my hand, and kind of rolling the grip on my thumb, if that makes any sense.

It also helps, if you keep the weight off your hands by gripping the tank with your legs. I still need practice with this, but my lower clipons make me very aware when I start to put weight on my hands.

You don't have to get the revs perfect, even a non-slipper clutch will take up some rev difference.

Just keep practicing, you'll get it :)

Oh, and it's more fun and sounds cooler then a slipper clutch ;)
I'm really starting to enjoy banging down the gears while hard on the brakes, all the while setting up for the corner.

=========

P.S. - Make sure you've adjusted your hand controls. Even with the stock stuff you can rotate the brake/clutch lever up and down.
I've been practicing this myself. And one thing to remember for new guys, if your RPMs are already pretty low, you don't need to blip much or at all because the RPM difference isn't as great at lower RPM. The higher the RPM, the more blip you need.

So I started practicing under heavy breaking/higher RPMs and it was much easier to learn. Then I could appy this to lower RPMs.

I do the same, blip by rolling my thumb, works great for me.
 

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first or first two fingers on brake, thumb and last two fingers blip the throttle whilst still applying pressure on brakes from first one or two finger(s). practice makes perfect, youtube MCN and they do a good video how to on it.

you'll get to a point where all you have to do when you're downshifting into a corner is be hard on the brakes, roll off throttle real quick and just downshift no clutch. only time i use my clutch is starting and stopping, other than that i dont touch it.
 

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not sure if this will help anyone or not. visuals always help me more than an explanation alone. plus, i get to post-whore my vid. this is me last year at putnam park with nesba. even tho my bike had a slipper, i was rev-matching. we tried this camera angle and it turned out pretty cool...




s3aturnr
 

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not sure if this will help anyone or not. visuals always help me more than an explanation alone. plus, i get to post-whore my vid. this is me last year at putnam park with nesba. even tho my bike had a slipper, i was rev-matching. we tried this camera angle and it turned out pretty cool...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2hFtukxqI0A


s3aturnr
Your video still scares me... As you blip, that brake lever is coming in harder. Hopefully you don't lock up the front.

The MCN video is pretty good. You can tell the dude has been doing it for years because that brake lever doesn't move. It just stays in a constant position. Good post.
 

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Trash Panda Racing
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I've been practicing this myself. And one thing to remember for new guys, if your RPMs are already pretty low, you don't need to blip much or at all because the RPM difference isn't as great at lower RPM. The higher the RPM, the more blip you need.

So I started practicing under heavy breaking/higher RPMs and it was much easier to learn. Then I could appy this to lower RPMs.

I do the same, blip by rolling my thumb, works great for me.
This is super good advice and I feel like a lot of novice riders neglect to see this. Especially with city riding, the amount of blip needed to rev match is very small. Try not to pay attention to what your RPMs are set at by visually looking, but rather just listen and try to downshift around the same RPMs so the amount of blip is consistently the same when braking to a normal stop on the street.

After some practice, you should start to feel how much blip is needed in comparison to how much throttle you just closed to brake.

Here's another good vid on downshifting showing both the right and the wrong techniques.
 
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