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Discussion Starter #1
Here is a question for the experienced.

I have lifted off both wheels while on track. It seems every time it happens, the rear gets squirly on landing? What gives? Suspension set, bike performs well the only thing is I am not running a damper. Is that what I need to keep the bike settled when coming down? The rear normally touches first, it happens so fast I can't tell if it starts before or after the front touches down.
 

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End of the month!
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Discussion Starter #2
Other times both seem to touchdown at the same time. My thinking is that the rear doesn't get silly until the front touches and the wheels are not aligned for whatever reason (normally me). And yes, I get bad head shake too. I know I need a damper just for that reason alone.
 

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track junkie
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throttle input is what's gonna make the back loose on landing. either too much or too little. input on the bars is what gets you headshake. it's difficult to lift the front and stay neutral on the bars, tho. a damper will help that, but i think it's important to understand why the bike does what it does before you mask it with parts...


s3aturnr
 

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Discussion Starter #4
hmmm.... more of a maintenance throttle type thing?

Yea, that is why I am asking. Thanks
 

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pin it to win it
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So you have a track were you get air born? Try to land both at the same time or rear slightly first. Stay on the throttle.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Yea but you really have to try to do it or be crazy aggressive on the gas. The crest at the exit of turn 10a at Mid-Ohio will send you airborn if you have little regard for the slight right turn at the bottom of the crest. But is repeatable.

I am still trying to wrap my head around it. I can keep it on the ground by putting more body weight forward and/or a slight roll off pre crest or by simply going slower or even being in a higher gear. Since going slower isn't really an option right now and a higher gear feels sluggish, I am looking at rider error first and other stuff second.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I would bet it is similar to that, front up higher than the rear. Rear really a few inches off the ground with a wiggle on landing.

Now let me look at this differently, how do the fast guys carry speed over crests? I see other riders go over that crest without leaving the ground going faster than me. Why do I jump and they don't?
 

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pin it to win it
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Try keeping steady throttle over the crest. Not accelerating but not slowing down either.
 

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"The Dude abides .. "
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not sure how serious of a question this is to be honest, but possibly try rear brake over the crest.. stay on the gas, but a little rear brake keeps the front down. some have to do the same out of the bowl at turn 4 homestead, and exiting the chicane at Daytona, and cresting turn 4 at Barber..
mostly just keep loose on the bars too. let the bike drift a bit, especially up the big hill of turn 4 at Barber. You know in your head the track turns right at the crest, so you instinctively wanna push the right bar to go right, well, if the front is light as you crest the hill and ya are pushing, the wheel wont' be straight. You get all kinds of wobble, and you grip the bike even harder, which compounds the problem putting those forces through your body into the REST of the bike. There is tons of room to the left of t4 there, just let the bike run wide with little bar input and steady throttle.

I give that as an example as i don't race roadA. but principles may be the same. there are lots of things to work on to go faster.
 

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You will pretty much always experience a little wobbly/slide when landing.... the only way to have a 100% smooth landing is to have the tire rotation speed match the forward movement speed..... which is nearly impossible.

Rear brake will help, and being relaxed... but you'll never be 100% solid when landing. Because there is no ground traction/friction when airborne, you will need less throttle input to generate the same wheel speed as if you were grounded.

If you're wheel speed is 100km/h on asphalt, once you're airborn that wheel speed will increase to say, 120km/h because the ground traction is removed if you're maintaining your throttle input. There are so many variables to consider.

All of the above will "help" get a smoother landing, but you'll never be totally solid when you do unless you're god-like at riding.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Yes, this is a serious question! I am going to eat shit hard if I don't get a handle on this. It wasn't a problem last year, my pace simply wasn't fast enough. I either need to keep the wheels on the ground or figure out a rider/bike setup that keeps me in control when it happens.

Thanks for you input thus far. Churning it all in my head while reviewing my videos.
 

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pin it to win it
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Find some ppl faster than you in that section and ask them what they do
 

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The R stands for Respect!
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I would bet it is similar to that, front up higher than the rear. Rear really a few inches off the ground with a wiggle on landing.

Now let me look at this differently, how do the fast guys carry speed over crests? I see other riders go over that crest without leaving the ground going faster than me. Why do I jump and they don't?
I know you said that you had your suspension set but it really sounds like your rebound damping needs another look. Im sure you already know that traction and the "feeling" of traction are not the same thing when tuning. With minimum rebound, the shock could rebound and extend too far moving the chassis upward and possibly in your case pushing the wheel off the ground.

However on the opposite end of the spectrum with maximum rebound, the shock may not respond fast enough and "pack" which possibly in your case is holding the wheel off the ground.

I would take a close look at the atop fork screw adjustment and the rear shock shaft eyelet before any purchases. Also remember that if you've had a change in rider weight it will effect settings.

Lastly, someone already mentioned it but throttle control is key. So just remember that due to torque reaction, suspension rises in acceleration, if it rises enough, you'll be leaving the "sweet spot" in your suspension before you even hit the bump!
 

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Discussion Starter #17
No one has caught it on vid yet :(. They will next time though, I asked then to watch out in case I bite it and not take them out and so I can see what is going on back there.

My rear suspension is set pretty hard. Sag was set, my preload is at max and the suspension guy asked me a bunch of questions to fine tune the rest so not sure on those settings. Adjustments could be made I guess based on a faster pace since my last adjustments.

I am average weight I guess, 190lbs with gear with no recent changes in weight.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
lol, It's not because I am doing it right believe me, it don't happen every time either. It's definitely not my smoothest riding and I feel I am charging the corners (told by a control rider) with a very aggressive throttle, where everyone else is smooth and floats right over. I think if I smooth out my lines and pace throughout straights and corners, I won't have to get on the throttle so aggressively. I will start with a few laps with control rider, then have my suspension checked again based on a faster pace.

I am interested in a faster lap times and I would rather keep the wheels down but if it happens, I don't wanna wad it up either.
 
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